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	<title>Comments on: Heating and Cooling Plans Take a U-Turn</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/</link>
	<description>A House By The Park is a first-hand chronology of the design, planning, and construction of a modern home in Seattle.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 07 Sep 2010 01:41:10 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Darin</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-3807</link>
		<dc:creator>Darin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Apr 2009 12:32:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-3807</guid>
		<description>Mike,

Great Blog!  I&#039;ve been sifting through the information and you&#039;ve been doing a great job documenting everything.  As an architect, I&#039;m always very curious what&#039;s going on in my client&#039;s head&#039;s.

As a response to this post, we&#039;ve been specifying radiant heat which seems to be the most comfortable heating system.  In addition, we use an HRV or ERV to both supply constant fresh air, as well as temper the air from one area of the house to the other.  This way, the temperature at the lower level of the house is very close to the upper level(s).  In addition, we have been roughing in for a ductless mini split heat pump that can be fully installed at a later date.  The heat pump is a very efficient way to both heat and cool a house.  It&#039;s ductless and is very efficient.  Because we never really know exactly how much cooling we&#039;ll need because comfort is alway relative to the specific occupant, this gives our client&#039;s flexibility to tune their house to their own level of comfort.  Another advantage of the heat pump is that you can quickly change the temperature in the air while the radiant system catches up.  In addition to these measures, we do our best to design the house to not need any systems at all...ultimately, we hope our clients never need the heat pump.

Darin</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike,</p>
<p>Great Blog!  I&#8217;ve been sifting through the information and you&#8217;ve been doing a great job documenting everything.  As an architect, I&#8217;m always very curious what&#8217;s going on in my client&#8217;s head&#8217;s.</p>
<p>As a response to this post, we&#8217;ve been specifying radiant heat which seems to be the most comfortable heating system.  In addition, we use an HRV or ERV to both supply constant fresh air, as well as temper the air from one area of the house to the other.  This way, the temperature at the lower level of the house is very close to the upper level(s).  In addition, we have been roughing in for a ductless mini split heat pump that can be fully installed at a later date.  The heat pump is a very efficient way to both heat and cool a house.  It&#8217;s ductless and is very efficient.  Because we never really know exactly how much cooling we&#8217;ll need because comfort is alway relative to the specific occupant, this gives our client&#8217;s flexibility to tune their house to their own level of comfort.  Another advantage of the heat pump is that you can quickly change the temperature in the air while the radiant system catches up.  In addition to these measures, we do our best to design the house to not need any systems at all&#8230;ultimately, we hope our clients never need the heat pump.</p>
<p>Darin</p>
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		<title>By: Mike D.</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-1641</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 16:53:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-1641</guid>
		<description>Carl: There&#039;s no need to rush through design and planning when you can&#039;t even break ground until the spring anyway.  Thanks for the heat pump info... that&#039;s probably indeed what we&#039;ll be using.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carl: There&#8217;s no need to rush through design and planning when you can&#8217;t even break ground until the spring anyway.  Thanks for the heat pump info&#8230; that&#8217;s probably indeed what we&#8217;ll be using.</p>
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		<title>By: Carl Heldmann</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-1639</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl Heldmann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 14:35:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-1639</guid>
		<description>Hi Mike, I hadn’t been to your blog in awhile…thought you’d be further along.
If you haven’t decided on a HVAC system yet, you might want to consider an Air to Air heat ump with a gas furnace auxiliary back up (all one unit).
I looked up Seattle’s weather (http://www.beautifulseattle.com/clisumm.htm), and I think an air to air heat pump would work fine for your situation, seldom utilizing the auxiliary back-up.
I’ve used heat pumps in building for over 25 years. They are great once you get used to the cooler temperature air output during the heating phase.
The technology has improved to the point that they will operate to well down below freezing without calling for the auxiliary back up.
Check all this out with an HVAC supplier/installer…or have your builder do it.
Here’s a link to a blurb about the Bryant Hybrid: http://www.bryant.com/news/pr-20061025.shtml. (I’ve always used Trane)
Good luck, Merry Christmas &amp; Happy New Year.
Carl Heldmann
www.byoh.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Mike, I hadn’t been to your blog in awhile…thought you’d be further along.<br />
If you haven’t decided on a HVAC system yet, you might want to consider an Air to Air heat ump with a gas furnace auxiliary back up (all one unit).<br />
I looked up Seattle’s weather (<a href="http://www.beautifulseattle.com/clisumm.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.beautifulseattle.com/clisumm.htm</a>), and I think an air to air heat pump would work fine for your situation, seldom utilizing the auxiliary back-up.<br />
I’ve used heat pumps in building for over 25 years. They are great once you get used to the cooler temperature air output during the heating phase.<br />
The technology has improved to the point that they will operate to well down below freezing without calling for the auxiliary back up.<br />
Check all this out with an HVAC supplier/installer…or have your builder do it.<br />
Here’s a link to a blurb about the Bryant Hybrid: <a href="http://www.bryant.com/news/pr-20061025.shtml" rel="nofollow">http://www.bryant.com/news/pr-20061025.shtml</a>. (I’ve always used Trane)<br />
Good luck, Merry Christmas &amp; Happy New Year.<br />
Carl Heldmann<br />
<a href="http://www.byoh.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.byoh.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: Mike D.</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-1494</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Dec 2008 20:07:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-1494</guid>
		<description>Steve: Thanks... I just caught that on Contemporist today as well.  Truly, truly spectacular.  I love everything about it, and it&#039;s a great example of what you can do if money is no object. Seriously, it seems perfect in every way.

Cost-wise, it&#039;s probably at least $400 per square foot, and at about 7000 square feet, that&#039;s $2.8m in construction costs plus maybe $1.4m in soft costs (using the 2/3rds 1/3rd rule), so that&#039;s $4.2m.  My math and estimates could obviously be off, but that&#039;s many multiples beyond what I&#039;m spending.

Still though... its a great, great example of the frontier of energy efficient luxury homes.  If it costs that amount to build now, it will cost much less in 5-10 years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve: Thanks&#8230; I just caught that on Contemporist today as well.  Truly, truly spectacular.  I love everything about it, and it&#8217;s a great example of what you can do if money is no object. Seriously, it seems perfect in every way.</p>
<p>Cost-wise, it&#8217;s probably at least $400 per square foot, and at about 7000 square feet, that&#8217;s $2.8m in construction costs plus maybe $1.4m in soft costs (using the 2/3rds 1/3rd rule), so that&#8217;s $4.2m.  My math and estimates could obviously be off, but that&#8217;s many multiples beyond what I&#8217;m spending.</p>
<p>Still though&#8230; its a great, great example of the frontier of energy efficient luxury homes.  If it costs that amount to build now, it will cost much less in 5-10 years.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-1482</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Dec 2008 15:23:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-1482</guid>
		<description>Hey Mike,

Have a look at this house, similar orientation to yours: on the water with west facing glazing. They are using geothermal/radiant heating &amp; cooling plus solar.

http://www.contemporist.com/2008/12/18/the-truro-residence-by-zeroenergy-design/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Mike,</p>
<p>Have a look at this house, similar orientation to yours: on the water with west facing glazing. They are using geothermal/radiant heating &amp; cooling plus solar.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.contemporist.com/2008/12/18/the-truro-residence-by-zeroenergy-design/" rel="nofollow">http://www.contemporist.com/2008/12/18/the-truro-residence-by-zeroenergy-design/</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Liam T.</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-1235</link>
		<dc:creator>Liam T.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2008 06:30:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-1235</guid>
		<description>Hi Mike,
I represent HVAC equipment for the commercial markets.  I can help you out with design of equipment, as well as hook you up with some consulting engineer friends of mine, that would have great insight on the types of systems you are looking at.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Mike,<br />
I represent HVAC equipment for the commercial markets.  I can help you out with design of equipment, as well as hook you up with some consulting engineer friends of mine, that would have great insight on the types of systems you are looking at.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mike D.</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-768</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 23:49:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-768</guid>
		<description>Rich: Thanks for the link.  Very interesting.  I&#039;m *definitely* going to have a multi-zone thermostat system to help handle the different loads of each room, but the idea in that Norwegian house is nice -- set things automatically based on known load variables.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rich: Thanks for the link.  Very interesting.  I&#8217;m *definitely* going to have a multi-zone thermostat system to help handle the different loads of each room, but the idea in that Norwegian house is nice &#8212; set things automatically based on known load variables.</p>
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		<title>By: Rich</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-767</link>
		<dc:creator>Rich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 23:43:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-767</guid>
		<description>Mike, When I saw this I could not help but think of your project.

Rich

http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2008/11/25/greathomesanddestinations/1125-norway_5.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike, When I saw this I could not help but think of your project.</p>
<p>Rich</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2008/11/25/greathomesanddestinations/1125-norway_5.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2008/11/25/greathomesanddestinations/1125-norway_5.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Mike D.</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-746</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Nov 2008 20:56:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-746</guid>
		<description>Thanks Steve.  Good info.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Steve.  Good info.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/archive/2008/11/11/heating-and-cooling-plans-take-a-u-turn/comment-page-1/#comment-726</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 14:50:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ahousebythepark.com/journal/?p=315#comment-726</guid>
		<description>Hey Mike,

I can take a simplified stab at this to get you started. 

To calculate heat loss you need the U values and square feet of all external facing materials, windows, ceilings, walls, doors etc. The U value is BTUs lost per hr, per square foot (U=1/R). For a rough calculation you also need the temperature difference between the interior and exterior of the structure. You can use two figures, one for the cooling season, one for the heating season. This is very important, because heat transfer increases exponentially as the temperature difference increases. If the temperature is equal on both sides, no transfer, if it&#039;s 30 degrees the transfer rate is obviously much higher.

There is also heat loss for ventilation (heat exchangers reduce this), door traffic, and voids in construction where different materials meet. This is where older homes perform poorly. Today with SIPs, spray foam etc you get a very tight structure so the heat loss in voids is minimal.

Now if you look at your windows, a quality triple pane Low E/Argon gas filled, fixed, window comes it at around R=5 or 6, U=1.7. Supposedly there is a krypton filled window that performs at an R=10, U=0.1 but it probably comes with a Superman price tag. A wall of SIP construction is rated around R=25, U=0.04, 4 to 5 times the performance of glass. Straw bale (I know, crazy idea) comes in at a massive R=48, U=0.02.

A couple other considerations:

â€¢ Think about the home&#039;s performance in summerâ€” it&#039;s not just about heat gain from the sunâ€”even with the shade down, there is substantial heat transfer through the windows putting more load on your cooling system.

â€¢ When you have a vaulted room heat moves quickly to the ceiling, forced air adds to the air movement, making it seem breezy so you end up increasing the temperature. Radiant heat travels slower, through you for a better comfort level. Unless you are on the couch, then you need a blanket or small gas insert, wood stove, etc. (It does tend to warm up the furniture though).

â€¢ If you spend more on a geothermal/radiant system, you may not get your money back through operating costs, but the house will have a higher resale value.  

â€¢ If you can, check out homes with these different systems in the middle of winter to see what you prefer.

There are all kinds of tables online to plug in your numbers for heat transfer. 

Hope this helps.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Mike,</p>
<p>I can take a simplified stab at this to get you started. </p>
<p>To calculate heat loss you need the U values and square feet of all external facing materials, windows, ceilings, walls, doors etc. The U value is BTUs lost per hr, per square foot (U=1/R). For a rough calculation you also need the temperature difference between the interior and exterior of the structure. You can use two figures, one for the cooling season, one for the heating season. This is very important, because heat transfer increases exponentially as the temperature difference increases. If the temperature is equal on both sides, no transfer, if it&#8217;s 30 degrees the transfer rate is obviously much higher.</p>
<p>There is also heat loss for ventilation (heat exchangers reduce this), door traffic, and voids in construction where different materials meet. This is where older homes perform poorly. Today with SIPs, spray foam etc you get a very tight structure so the heat loss in voids is minimal.</p>
<p>Now if you look at your windows, a quality triple pane Low E/Argon gas filled, fixed, window comes it at around R=5 or 6, U=1.7. Supposedly there is a krypton filled window that performs at an R=10, U=0.1 but it probably comes with a Superman price tag. A wall of SIP construction is rated around R=25, U=0.04, 4 to 5 times the performance of glass. Straw bale (I know, crazy idea) comes in at a massive R=48, U=0.02.</p>
<p>A couple other considerations:</p>
<p>â€¢ Think about the home&#8217;s performance in summerâ€” it&#8217;s not just about heat gain from the sunâ€”even with the shade down, there is substantial heat transfer through the windows putting more load on your cooling system.</p>
<p>â€¢ When you have a vaulted room heat moves quickly to the ceiling, forced air adds to the air movement, making it seem breezy so you end up increasing the temperature. Radiant heat travels slower, through you for a better comfort level. Unless you are on the couch, then you need a blanket or small gas insert, wood stove, etc. (It does tend to warm up the furniture though).</p>
<p>â€¢ If you spend more on a geothermal/radiant system, you may not get your money back through operating costs, but the house will have a higher resale value.  </p>
<p>â€¢ If you can, check out homes with these different systems in the middle of winter to see what you prefer.</p>
<p>There are all kinds of tables online to plug in your numbers for heat transfer. </p>
<p>Hope this helps.</p>
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